Sai Baba EXPOSED!: Sai Baba Devotees Sued By Sai Baba Devotees

12 January 2006

Sai Baba Devotees Sued By Sai Baba Devotees

I think even the International Sai Tribune couldn't have cooked up this story, because it's true!

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MUMBAI, Wednesday, January 11, 2006

Sigh! Baba - (Alternate Link)

Followers of Sai Baba file case against devotees of Sathya Sai of Puttaparthi to restrain them from calling him a reincarnation of the Shirdi seer

Manoj R Nair

Claims by followers of Sathya Sai Baba of Puttaparthi that he is a reincarnation of Sai Baba of Shirdi have enraged devotees of the latter. They have filed a suit in the court at Rahata, in Ahmadnagar district, asking the court to restrain people from making such claims. The case will be heard on January 14. The controversy began when an organisation, Bharat Cultural Integration Committee, wanted to club Sathya Sai's 80th birthday celebrations with the Shirdi seer's 168th birthday in November last year. The invite to the function carried a story that claimed the Sai Baba was born to a woman called Devagiriamma in 1838 and that before his death in 1918, he had promised his followers to come back after eight years, thus lending credence to the reincarnation theory.

Though it is universally agreed that Sai Baba died in 1918, his followers contend that his origins are unknown. For this reason, the Shirdi shrine has never observed any birthday of the saint. Versova resident and ardent Sai Baba devotee Manu Gidwani who has objections to the claim made by followers of Sathya Sai Baba says: "I respect the faith of the followers of Sathya Sai Baba but by claiming incarnation, they have insulted the followers of Sai Baba."

The literature on the saint brought out by Shirdi Sansthan, the organisation that runs the shrine, says the birthday and name of the holyman's parents are not known. The Sansthan's books also do not recognise claims of other godmen to be a reincarnation.

The celebration was cancelled after the objections; but the followers of Sai Baba have sought a permanent injunction restraining anyone from making claims about the birthday.

"Every saint has followers. But how can anybody claim to be an incarnation?" demands Dr Pyarelal Tiwari, a cardiologist at Bombay Hospital and a member of the Shri Sai Baba Sansthan.

However, followers of the Sathya Sai Baba insist their guru is an incarnation of the Shirdi Sai Baba. "It is a fact; there are so many evidences in this regard," said Sudhir Joshi, a follower of the Puttaparthi godman. The devotees of the Southern guru say Sai Baba had said that he will be reborn eight years after his Samadhi and meet his followers to solve their problems. Sathya Sai Baba was born eight years later after Sai Baba's death, on November 23, 1926.

Comments:

Name : Dhiraj Bhatia

It is truly abusrd to see one godman claiming to be a god himself. For Sai devotees Shirdi Sai Baba is the true god. Sudhir Joshi Follower of the Godman claims that there are facts about the evidences of incarnation. Those are just the fictitous facts made up.

Name : shrikrishna Dhale

Email ID : shrikrishna_dhale@nospam.rediffmail.com

Worshiping False God India is becoming a fertile land for all those so-called Baba's, Maharshi's, Amma's and self proclaimed GOD. Considering the illiteracy of India it's very easy to have lot of followers too. In every nook and corner of city you will find such Baba's flaring up like mushrooms. All such people calls himself/herself the reincarnation of some or the other God. Why does Sathya Sai Baba of Puttaparthi need to call himself reincarnation of Sai Baba of Shirdi. If he has some Devine power that will prove him. The logic of being born after eight years later after Sai Baba's death, on November 23, 1926 does not qualify him to be called so. Other wise every person born that year will call himself the reincarnation of Sai Baba. I think we need to emulate Buddha who never called himself God and still he has lot of followers across India and world.

Name : Ganesh Shilimkar

Email ID : shakkyguy@nospam.yahoo.com

This is ridiculous to call himself that he is reincarnation of Shri Sai Baba of Shirdi. How is this possible? If you are reincarnation of Shri Sai Baba of Shirdi, then just prove it. Show some Chamkar or your power in front of the world & media. Just saying that I am reincarnation of Shri Sai Baba of Shirdi does not make any sense. I think everyone should do needful things, so that no one can take misuse of any GOD's name.

Name : Bombay Srinivasan

Email ID : vsvasan99@nospam.yahoo.com

Sai Ram. I am proud to call myself as a devotee of both Shiridi Sai and also Puttaparthi Sai. In the spiritual world it is not nice to analysis the belief of the devotees. We never question the reincarnation of Lord Rama as Lord Krishna. We accept anything which we read. But we are unable to believe the TRUTH when it is available in your own life time. For many people who make such comments of criticism, May I ask one simple question. "Have anyone of you seen or worshipped when Baba was alive in Shiridi?" Or " Have anyone of you cared to visit Sri Sathya Sai baba or taken any efforts to know about the present Avatar?"

Name : Mihir

Email ID : mihirddesai@nospam.yahoo.com

Why ? Why is it so difficult to follow a simple principles in life ? "Live and let Live". Let people believe whatever they want to believe in. Instead of cross-examining Godmen, why don't you see how much sin you people have committed so far ? Narrow-minded jerks

Name : Nutan Rathin Das
Email ID : nutan_rathin@nospam.yahoo.com
The Editor, Mumbai Mirror. (Page 14 - Your corner) Could we humans use our intelligence to its fullest potential,to allow ourselves experience whether Sri Sathya Sai Baba's statement made almost over 6 decades ago, in a then remote village at Puttaparthi in Andhra Pradesh, holds any truth or not? A calm mind with a sincere prayer offered to Sri Shirdi Saibaba or Sri Sathya Saibaba will itself give the answer to doubting minds. (A lesson a 3 year old devotee of Sri Shirdi Sai taught me 14 years ago). Do we have to prove to our children we are their parents or would we have to be dragged to a court of law to prove our status? Let us imbibe values and knowledge from the teachings of these two great Saints, and try to fulfil our mission on this earth as human beings, rather than dwell and debate on matters as vast and deep as the ocean and space and which are certainly not within our reach! Incidentally, it is the intelligent and fortunate who are drawn to such Saints to be able to realise all this. A simple test put to onself (as explained above), would prove ones faith or lack of it and would indeed help settle many unsettled minds and sighing hearts Sai Sai!!! Mrs. Nutan Das

Sai Baba Exposed says:

This is actually tame stuff from Sathya Sai Baba, who has also claimed to be the combined form of every God that is. In short, he claims to be the incarnation of Krishna, Rama, Vishnu, Brahma, Devi, Shiva, Ganesh, Hanuman, Jesus, Buddha, etc etc etc.

If you don't believe me, just see what he said on the 17th May, 1968:

"This is a human form in which every divine entity, every divine principle, that is to say, all the names and forms ascribed by man to God, are manifest. Do not allow doubt to distract you; if you only install, in the altar of your heart, steady faith in my Divinity, you can win a vision of my Reality ... You are very fortunate that you have a chance to experience the bliss of the vision of the Sarvadaivathwa swaroopam (the form that is all forms of the Gods) now, in this life itself ... But ponder a moment on this Sathya Sai Manifestation; in this age of rampant materialism, aggressive disbelief and irreverence, what is it that brings to it the adoration of millions from all over the world? You will be convinced that the basic reason for this is the supra-worldly Divinity in human form."

Feel free to read the whole speech.

Follow-up Articles:

The Shirdi Inheritance

Sai Baba Legal Dispute - More Reportage

Shirdi Sai vs. Satya Sai

Sai Devotees - Still Missing The (Legal) Point

Shirdi Sansthan Nullifies Reincarnation Claims

Return To Main Page

16 Comments:

This is my response to Mr. Bombay Srinivasan (Email ID : vsvasan99@nospam.yahoo.com).
He should realize that the spiritual world he is talking about is a cult. and Mr SSB is no more than cult leader. There have been many cult leaders in the histroy and there will be many more. It is important to undestand that in every cult the memebers always believe in their leader. Who knows what Rama and Krishna were? Why Bother?

He says -
"But we are unable to believe the TRUTH when it is available in your own life time. For many people who make such comments of criticism, May I ask one simple question. "Have anyone of you seen or worshipped when Baba was alive in Shiridi?" Or " Have anyone of you cared to visit Sri Sathya Sai baba or taken any efforts to know about the present Avatar?"

What is the TRUTH he is talking about? People are easily gulible. So reference to Shiridi Sai baba is irrelevent as it is all anecdotal history. And I have spent 8 years of my life to Know Mr SSB and finally found out that he is cult leader. Does that answer your question Mr Devotee (or in other words a cult member)

By 3 D, at 14 January, 2006 16:19
devaran,
Yours is a relatively old blog. But as a literally over-blown agnostic(am fat), you bring sense to such exchanges.
regards
d

By deewit, at 13 October, 2006 16:48
devaran,
Yours is a relatively old blog. But as a literally over-blown agnostic(am fat), you bring sense to such exchanges.
regards
d

By deewit, at 13 October, 2006 16:49
How the system works at Sai Baba

Just see the ambitious IAS and other government officials who are retiring with in a span of 2-7 years. Go to them with voluntary origination like Bharat Cultural committee. Take advantage of the system and ask them to donate or spent govt money indirectly for the promotion of Sai Baba projects. Sai Baba after retirement will give them a job at his place. This is how the officals are running the Sai baba corporation through govt money. See one example on Doordarshan “ Sprite of unity concert” See the sponsor. Now tell me this is true or not

By Anonymous, at 04 May, 2007 06:54
Bharat Cultural Integration Committee a flagship of sai baba propogenda has tie up with Doordarshan to broadcast a programme and the sponcer of that peogramme is a Govt of india org. in Hyderabad

By Anonymous, at 12 June, 2007 17:22
I am a strong believer of Shirdi Sai Baba and really hate to hear that Sathya Sai Baba is recarnation of Shirdi Sai Baba. People who believe Sathya Sai have their own choice and god bless them, but why try to connect something that is so irelevent.

There are tons of facts truths that have exposed Mr. Sathya Sai, so called. Anyway, Sathya said need to prove to be a human first, then a straight men, not a gay, and being a god is far more thing. Probably, zillions of births and sufferings god might have mercy on him. Many of Shirdi sai devotees wanted to say this and I am just verbalizing for them.

God bless.

By Anonymous, at 13 July, 2007 05:13
SAI RAM

Lord Rama, Krishna, Jesus had all taken human form
u had people who believed them n people who dint.

So dear friends, what can i say?
EVEN TO HAVE FAITH IN GODS LIVING FORM, SEE HIM OR WORSHIP THE LORD INCARNATE....
U NEED TO BE BLESSED...!

MOST IMP.. what is imp is not who is GOD and which God is powerful?
I believe that every form of God is one... SAB KA MALIK EK HAI

Not enough if u say it ..understand it and seek God through divinity n noble actions not name n form

MAY THE LORD ...ANY LORD U BELIEVE IN ;) give u this simple sense.

PEOPLE ... how can u say u r d follower of one God when u dont follow his teachings....

ALL R DIFFERENT NAMES.... GOD IS ONE
RISE..AWAKE .... stop insulting ur faith in d almighty.

By Anonymous, at 20 November, 2007 17:32
God is there to fill.
When Lord Shiridi sai baba was there then there was some people who says him as a dhongi,same in case of sathya sai.
But what's the truth?
Try to take one step toward's him and the rest u will find to know.

By Anonymous, at 21 November, 2007 06:16
Why don't this so called Satya Sai of Putthaparthi go out and see craving people who are malnutritioned .... He sits in AC and big banglow .. why dont he give shelter to poor in his luxurious house ... totally a bluff ..... He is not even the mud under the Shirdi Saint's feet ...

By Anonymous, at 09 January, 2008 23:31
When the Pandavas believed in their Lord Sri Krishna, they undoubtedly benefitted, but the Kauvravas who doubted were the losers. So also during the short life span of the Messiah - Lord Jesus Christ, Sri Shirdi Saibaba and Sri Sathya Saibaba. Those who believe, have and are still benefitting. So Mr.Devaran ....did it take you 8 long years to realise that Bhagwan Sri Sathya Saibaba is only a Cult Leader??? Neither Sri Sathya Saibaba nor his devotees need you to give your ratings. Go beyond this and you'll see that each Soul is potent! We have all been rated by the ONE above us all and that puts us where we are today!

I think We all know the purpose of our birth and let us rise up to it.

By Anonymous, at 30 April, 2008 19:56
Sri Anjaneyam,
As described in the Holy Geeta
"one is not willing to know me will never know and one who knows me needs to know nothing anymore" its just the faith which decides as what we are.Is it faith of Hanuman which made Rama Great or is Hanuman drawn to the wisdom of Rama. In fact its both but which comes first depends on us.

By Unknown, at 21 July, 2008 19:53
The definition of a cult is the religion down the street from yours. Live and let live. I have been to see baba twice to receive darshan. He does good works and the people worship him. The bible says you will know people's goodness by their WORKS.

By Anonymous, at 03 August, 2008 23:44
Yeah, we should live and let live. Because a village with fresh water and hospitals that give free operations and schools that give "free" education are worth much more than the tears and heartbreak of an abused child, right?

By Swami Saiexposedananda, at 05 August, 2008 12:05
Om Sai Ram
NADIA SHIBPUR SAI SADGURU SAMITY Regd. No S/1L/45375,West Bengal Act XXVI 1961
I.T. REGD. 80G-12(A)
To
The All Sai Devotees
Sub: An appeal for generous contribution to construct the first Sai temple in Bengal.
Dear sir,
We the Shibpur sai sad guru samity wants to build a permanent structure of Sai temple at our village. The temple we are going to build will not only be a place for prayer but it will be a place for cure for the thousands of suffering people. We have attached a history with this letter so that you know the reason for which we want to set up our dream temple of Sai baba.
Your help will mean a great relief for not only us but for lakhs of people of our Nadia district and West Bengal state. This will be the first temple of sai baba in West Bengal. Please help us so that we could achieve what we have fixed as target for ourselves few years back.
With many thanks,
Yours faithfully,
Prabhat Joardar.
HISTORY OF SHIBPUR SAI TEMPLE
Way back in 1850, Ramdas Biswas a wealthy villager of Shibpur village of Nadia’s Nakashipara established a temple in the compound of his house to offer daily puja in it. He never took any help from anybody but set up the temple on his own cost.
Past facts did not establish whether Ramdas set up any idol of Shirdi Sai Baba as he was alive then. But so far the information are available, the daily prayer was stopped in the temple of 1920. The reason behind it is hitherto unknown.
The prayer stopped and the temple slowly became birth place of venomous snake with dense bush and cobwebs surrounding it. Forget offering prayer, local residents dared not to go anywhere near to the temple site fearing snakes would take their lives.
However, as lights follow the darkness, rainbow follows rain; villagers of Shibpur in 1992 saw a neem tree sprouting out of the dense bush adjoining the crumbling structure of the temple.
What made them more surprised that deadly snakes also stated fleeing after the neem tree was born there. With snakes making exit, villagers started cleaning up a part of bush and a green field was born there with children began playing near to it. A way to enter the temple was also found thereafter.
The villagers took all these things lightly till 1999 when during Guru Purnima, Sai Baba, who died in the year 1918, appeared in the night dream of Amit Biswas, the great grandson of Ramdas.In the dream Baba told Amit that long before Ramdas used to offer prayer to him in the temple where the neem tree has suddenly sprouted up.
“Your great grandfather used to offer daily puja to me 100 years ago. He was my devotee and used to pray for me sitting in the temple for hours. But all have gone after that. So I have planted the neem tree there to eradicate all evils. I now want the prayer should be restarted in the temple. Make that temple a heaven for the people. Whoever would visit the temple would get all he/she wants,” Baba told Amit.
Amit woke up with the divine instruction next morning and rushed to the temple area. He cleaned up the area and got rid of all bushes and cobwebs used to remain there.
Amit established a clay idol of Sai Baba and began offering puja. After he spread the message, he got from baba in sleep, to local villagers, the villagers got inspired. Leaving fear and evil spirit behind them, the villagers started pouring in the temple and began offering pujas.
Believe it or not, within days Sai Baba’s promise started becoming true. After offering puja in the temple, though dilapidated, a woman gave birth to her first baby after 12 years of her marriage. The doctor had predicted that she could not give birth medically. She is not alone, some villagers, who were suffering from chronic and incurable diseases, got cured after offering prayer to Saibaba in the temple.
Stunned villagers stood up and took a resolution that they would protect the temple at any cost.
In 2003, advised by the local villagers, Amit formed a trustee committee to rebuild the temple. Nadia-Shibpur-Sai-Sadguru Samity was formed thereafter.
The resolution the committee took was that a new structure of the temple would be made and the trustee board would work for the amelioration of the poor people in the area. They also took oath that organization would work for all social causes like campaigning against dowry, drug addiction of students.
The committee then began working according to their resolution and campaigned extensively against dowry, child marriage, drug addiction etc etc. Worthy to mention, the villagers also started getting success. Their achievements began spreading like wild fire in the villages of Nakashipara and out of it.
A national award winner and a famous sculptor Subir Paul could not sit idle after hearing the activities of the Sai Sadguru Samity.
Inspired, the sculptor constructed a human seize fiber-glass idol of the Baba.
Paul himself admitted that while making the idol for six months some miraculous spirit grappled him.
“I never made such perfect structure like Sai Baba before,” he said.
Getting the idol quite unexpectedly, the committee thus could not sit idle too. Although not financially equipped, but the villagers began constructing the temple.
They put together bamboos and erected a structure in the temple areas keeping the old structure intact. The idol seated on a golden chariot has been kept under the thatched temple now in place.
Currently, the devotees offer their daily pujas, arti and bhajan, two times daily. Trustee committee has recently begun collecting subscription from the people of all walks of lives to build up the permanent concrete structure.
The committee has also begun celebrating Sai festival for five days in the third week of April every year. Once the permanent structure will be in place, crores of people would visit the temple and their woes would get healed.
The hands thus are stretched for help from anybody who wants to cure the woes of the people.

About Us
Nadia Shibpur Sai Sadguru samity has been working for last five years for the social causees in the Shibpur village of Nadia district. The trustee board, which was set up in 2003 to construct the permanent temple, has taken up issues of the society one by one and addressed it in whatever way possible. The committee has for last five years been organizing intense awareness programs against HIV infection and AIDS disease, dowry, leprosy and many such health issues including polio virus and snake bite. The committee has also been working on to aware people to take care of the health of pregnant mothers. It has also been working to send girl children to schools in the villages.
The committee has also been campaigning against the drug addiction among the jobless youths of the village and its surrounding areas.
The Nadia Shibpur Sai Sadguru Samity has organized about 20 health camps in the last five years in which aged people were given free clinical supports. The senior citizens were given spectacles and free eye treatment. The pregnant mothers and new born babies were given vitamin and other required tablets free after proper medical checkups. The samity continuously for last several years gave pregnant mothers nutritious food so that the children born to them don’t see the first light of the day with diseases or permanent disabilities.
The children from the poor families are also given nutritious foods on regular basis so that they grow up with good physique. Fully aware that children won’t grow up if they don’t find themselves happy; the samity has been regularly spending some amount for the recreation of the children to make them happy. They are given toys and other things so that they find this world entertaining and interesting even after being born in poor families. The committee also contains a considerable number who are physically handicapped, SC, ST and farmers. So, special emphasis is being givenin this areas to uplift them.

Dream for the coming years.
Apart from its continuous rigorous campaigning against various social evils, curses and superstition, the Nadia Shibpur Sai Sadguru Samity has decided that in the coming years it will set up a animal hospital in the panchyat area. This is because the areas are inhabited by around 30,000 families and about 1 lakh cattle population in the areas. The villages, centering Shibpur, are inhabited by the people who earn their daily livelihood through cattle. Every years many domestic animal die because of diseases and they are untreated as the villagers don’t find it easy to bring the sick cattle to nearest sub-center of the animal hospital around 25 km away. How could poor people pay Rs 300 per trip and for other medical costs just earning Rs 60 per day?The Samity has taken a decision that it would definitely try to save the villagers by saving their animals.
Although government has taken oath that no student of the rural areas would kept away from the computer literacy, but it is easier to say than done.
The only high school of the village does not have a single computer while even a lowest graded high school in an urban area has many. We would try to open a computer school to educate students in our areas. Special attention will be given to girls students from the poor families.
The samity has been running a free teaching school for sometimes in which two senior educated men teach children free of cost . Its endevour will be to construct a free coaching center for the poor and underprivileged children of the society, specially scheduled castes and scheduled tribes.
The socity will also work for the improvement of agricultural land and try to improve the quality of lives of the farmers.
Religious activities performed daily.
Every day pujas are being organized twice daily in the bamboo made temple. Bhajans and arati along with chanting done in Bengali. The mantras are however rented in the air which is based on Sasnskrit slokas. Bengali food is given to baba during morning and evening prayers. This food later used as Prasada. Two persons belonging to muchi and Bagdi, two most backward castes of Bengal, distribute prasada to villagers. We give these two persons the task to distribute prasada as part of our war against caste-ism in our area. To be honest our such decision paid dividend. Many villagers who earlier had reservation to take prasada from a muchi or bagdi are now taking prasada from them quite freely.
The committee believes in the mantra: “One god governs all”. Sai Baba taught us that faith and patience are two more important things in human life. One cannot stay without the other.

Contract Us
Chairman / Secretary
NADIA SHIBPUR SAI SADGURU SAMITY
Regd. No S/1L/45375,West Bengal Act XXVI 1961
City offi:K.C.Lahiri Lane,Chasapara,P.O.Krishnanagar,Dist.-Nadia, West Bengal(India) 741101
Mandir: Vill. & P.O. Shibpur, P.S. Nakashipara, Dist. -Nadia, West Bengal (India) Pin-741191
Email address: shibpursaibaba@gmail.com
SAVING BANK A/C NO: 422310110000280 (BANK OF INDIA) KRISHNANAGAR BRANCH
Mob. No.-9434110881 / 9333120111

.

By Anonymous, at 24 October, 2008 04:34
It's a shame that followers of that criminal bastard spread such an insult, that he is a sort of reincarnation of the only Shirdi Sai. Don't know if Shirdi was a good kid, but the lusty self-claimed avatar living there in India nowadays is a criminal and should be shot dead.

By Anonymous, at 17 December, 2010 01:15
And, people who are devotees of Shirdi Sai: It's Sathya Sai himself who claims to be Shirdi since his age of 14, if I'm not wrong, then his devotees are just hanging on their beliefs, i.e., they spread that he is Shirdi reincarnated because he tells them that he is. You should try to stop him, the devotees are just his puppets, as ironically he says and they joyfully accept it (I'm serious, he says they're his puppets and they find it amazing. It's so stupid).

By Anonymous, at 17 December, 2010 01:20

Sai Baba EXPOSED!

12 January 2006

Sai Baba Devotees Sued By Sai Baba Devotees

16 Comments:

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Articles Of Note:

Name : Dhiraj Bhatia
It is truly abusrd to see one godman claiming to be a god himself. For Sai devotees Shirdi Sai Baba is the true god. Sudhir Joshi Follower of the Godman claims that there are facts about the evidences of incarnation. Those are just the fictitous facts made up.


Name : shrikrishna Dhale
Email ID : shrikrishna_dhale@nospam.rediffmail.com
Worshiping False God India is becoming a fertile land for all those so-called Baba's, Maharshi's, Amma's and self proclaimed GOD. Considering the illiteracy of India it's very easy to have lot of followers too. In every nook and corner of city you will find such Baba's flaring up like mushrooms. All such people calls himself/herself the reincarnation of some or the other God. Why does Sathya Sai Baba of Puttaparthi need to call himself reincarnation of Sai Baba of Shirdi. If he has some Devine power that will prove him. The logic of being born after eight years later after Sai Baba's death, on November 23, 1926 does not qualify him to be called so. Other wise every person born that year will call himself the reincarnation of Sai Baba. I think we need to emulate Buddha who never called himself God and still he has lot of followers across India and world.

Name : Ganesh Shilimkar
Email ID : shakkyguy@nospam.yahoo.com
This is ridiculous to call himself that he is reincarnation of Shri Sai Baba of Shirdi. How is this possible? If you are reincarnation of Shri Sai Baba of Shirdi, then just prove it. Show some Chamkar or your power in front of the world & media. Just saying that I am reincarnation of Shri Sai Baba of Shirdi does not make any sense. I think everyone should do needful things, so that no one can take misuse of any GOD's name.

Name : Bombay Srinivasan
Email ID : vsvasan99@nospam.yahoo.com
Sai Ram. I am proud to call myself as a devotee of both Shiridi Sai and also Puttaparthi Sai. In the spiritual world it is not nice to analysis the belief of the devotees. We never question the reincarnation of Lord Rama as Lord Krishna. We accept anything which we read. But we are unable to believe the TRUTH when it is available in your own life time. For many people who make such comments of criticism, May I ask one simple question. "Have anyone of you seen or worshipped when Baba was alive in Shiridi?" Or " Have anyone of you cared to visit Sri Sathya Sai baba or taken any efforts to know about the present Avatar?"